336 Steve Stewart - A Podcast Veteran (and fellow DJ) Shares His Transformation from Podcaster to Editor

:: 00:00

All right, my friend Steve Stewart, podcast editor, co-founder of the Podcast Editor Academy and founder of the world's largest podcast editor and most diverse podcast editing community in the world, How'd it do you?

:: 00:13

remembered all that. That's great, that's a lot.

:: 00:17

Podcast editor extraordinaire.

:: 00:20

It's my favorite thing in the world. Didn't know this.

:: 00:22

Didn't know I was going to love it until I started doing it. Crazy Well for the listener and for the viewer, it's obvious. Thank you for the gracing my wall back there. First.

:: 00:32

Oh, yes, the wall the podcast junkies.

:: 00:33

Look at the t-shirt. What do you call that? Your t-shirt? Hall of Fame.

:: 00:37

It's the t-shirt wall. My wife was trying to find a great Christmas gift for me. She couldn't figure out what I wanted and she's like well, you know, that wall that you got behind your live streams is kind of boring, and it really was. She came up with the idea, she did all the work and now I've got a wall of classic teas up on up there.

:: 00:54

So do you? So, yeah, lots of great stuff. If there ever there was an incentive for the listener to watch on YouTube which will make it on there, I've been doing a better job of getting this kind of on there and taking advantage of this great video that we're shooting nowadays courtesy of squadcast, so you can see that wall. Do t-shirts get swapped in and out?

:: 01:12

No, actually I'm supposed to extend it over here.

:: 01:15

Okay.

:: 01:16

And I'm sure we'll talk about why you can see this area now later in the interview. But we are planning on moving next year, so I'm not going to do anything else right now. Yes, see what we can do on the next place.

:: 01:26

So I probably should have had your episode. Do you remember your episode number? Your first appearance on Park yes Jenkins 21. 21 at Yikes.

:: 01:33

Or 22. I'm going to find 22 because it's still up on my overcast app. And you did chapters, which is not something you did back then. That's very good.

:: 01:41

Thank you and so thanks for coming back on and thanks for being an early supporter of the show. I mean, that was probably 2014-ish or maybe 15. But yeah, I was just getting started and I think we connected at some podcast conference where I saw you and I was like this guy looks like he knows what he's talking about.

:: 01:58

I was talking to LC Yuskebar when we met, because you were talking to her and then we just started talking. Oh, that's right, that's right. Yeah, but I did all that just to get on your show for the t-shirt.

:: 02:10

That's a pretty. So 10 years is 2024. Wild for me to think about, and so I really have to plan it. I've put the bug in Jared's ear that I want to speak and I want to talk, tell my 10 year story. So he said he might give me a shot on stage to do that. So that would be fun.

:: 02:28

So title the session the top five lessons I learned, okay. Or the top 10 if it's 10 years, yes, that would be great. Got to key it in that way, that'll work.

:: 02:36

Okay, I'm going to have to credit you for getting Steve Stewart to prep you for your talk. That's one of the tips Fantastic, that'd be great and I think I'll have to bring the t-shirts back for either. This is something I'm talking about. Some live brainstorming this with you, but one of the thoughts is to buy enough and then check to see who's going to actually be there from past guests, get them all new t-shirts and then have them sit as close to the front row as possible and then get a nice picture while you're on stage.

:: 03:04

Yes, or?

:: 03:04

get them to stand up or something like that. So I mean I'm at 300 plus interviews, so there's a good one.

:: 03:10

Well, you know, you don't need to do it that complicated. Just get all the shirts, put them in the front row. People who get there, just tell them you got to put it on for a selfie and they'll do it. Yes, you don't have to qualify them as being former guests.

:: 03:21

I mean.

:: 03:22

I'd wear this shirt, except I couldn't fit into it anymore.

:: 03:24

That's why it's on the wall. So talk a little bit about your podcasting journey, because obviously it's been a long time and there's folks that are going to be finding you for the first time with this episode. So, to the extent you want to cover, or what you want to cover, talk a little bit about that.

:: 03:40

Yeah, last time we talked I was on episode 162 of the Money Planet Source podcast. Been doing it since November 2010,. But I retired it in October 2015 at episode 200. And if they go back and listen to episode 22 of the podcast Junkies, they'll hear there was times when I was questioning why I was doing this and.

nancial blogger conference in: 2011

I didn't make it to the first one. I made it to the second one, fell in love with the community and I was known as well. There were very few podcasters at this so-called blogger conference and I was always encouraging people to start a podcast and so I became known as one of the few bloggers with podcast. They eventually let me speak and stuff, but I was always encouraging people to start and that turned into a career. Yeah, but going to FinCon why was it going to the story here?

:: 04:41

Just to start. I mean just how we started and just your podcast roots.

:: 04:46

Right. So I recorded my 200th episode at FinCon 2015, a year after you and I had the first conversation and I was going to launch a new show. In the meantime, there were two very famous bloggers from that community who were talking. They had been talking all year about starting a podcast and they were talking and they're talking, and they never pulled the trigger and they finally said we just need some help. So they contacted me. We had a conversation in December of 2015. And I said, steve, we just want to hit record, we do the rest. I'm like sure it's going to be a new side hustle, because I can't just do it for free and they're absolutely. Steve will pay you.

I was making less and minimum wage doing this thing, but it was fun.

It was something. I already knew all the skills. I wasn't great at it, but I knew what to do and I could help them out, get launched and edit their show. Well, there are two big name bloggers and, of course, with two big name bloggers in a space, other people in that space hear about it. By then, about a month later, when we launched the show. This is crazy, harry. So the show launched and it hit number five in the business category of iTunes back then it was still iTunes, even though their category is business investing. It hit number five in the business section. So you know, and it was in 24 hours.

:: 06:02

Crazy.

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So a lot of people heard about it and so people who I knew from FinCon were then next couple of months, we're like oh, we know Steve, we like Steve, we trust Steve, we don't want to edit, maybe Steve will edit. So it just became a career by about six months later, middle of 2016. It was all I could do, so I had to give up everything. I've been working on building a financial coaching business for about eight years. I already said that I retired to podcast, was going to start a new one. That didn't happen. I had previously quit the day job to focus completely on the financial coaching business, which just did this, and if people aren't watching, it's just a steady line yeah.

Just a steady line. It didn't really grow, even though I put more effort into it. So I thought, okay, good, I'll give it a shot. I'll go full time six months after I started doing it as a part time thing and that's my career now and I love it. I love it, love it, love it, love it, love it when you think about the jobs you've had your career, because I don't know how.

:: 06:58

I don't even remember how deep we got into the stuff that you do pre podcast. What is it that would be BC before or BP before podcast?

:: 07:08

BPJ yeah, before podcast junkies.

:: 07:10

Yeah, the 30 second recap of, like, the life you were living back then.

:: 07:16

Okay, well, we'll start with just the year 2000. I took a job with a company where I was auditing their units and franchise owners, so there's a lot of travel involved and that's how I started to hear about podcasts was. At first it was radio, but then I started hearing some radio shows talking about podcasts and that's how I started hearing about what a podcast was in 2000. I think I discovered it in 2005. So I wasn't one of the early, early dancers early compared a lot, but it was.

ept doing that until March of: 2015

:: 08:01

I noticed a trend or a through line of finance mentioned auditing as well. Is that something you studied or just something you had a passion for earlier?

:: 08:09

Okay, we got to go back further into time here, Harry. Let's go back and we talked about this in the first episode, or episode 22 of podcast junkies. Go back and listen to everybody. Dj From high school was in a breakdancing group.

Everybody can see my radio, so I was big into vinyl DJing and I was in Chicago, so I was in the Chicago house when it really started and so the music, all that stuff. And then I started working at record stores and kind of moved up the ranks, started working as assistant manager and then I actually got to run a couple of flagship stores when blockbuster got into the music scene and blockbuster music stores.

So I was involved there for many years. And then I what was the reason why? Oh, it's just an opportunity came up.

:: 08:55

Yeah.

:: 08:55

For an internal auditor position. With blockbuster music, I thought, well, this is perfect. I already know all the ins and outs. I already know everything that everybody tries to do to steal, because they tried it with me. So I'd be a great auditor and got the job. And I did that for probably about two years, and then we're going to go into some deep stories here.

Then in the year: 1997

pany that then worked with in: 2000

:: 10:19

I think what's interesting is that people take for granted Just crazy paths we take to end up where we are right now. Because if I told my story, I've got employment going this far back as working for, like a spy store, being a waiter, just working in, just rent. I worked in construction yeah, I was hard hats and climbing scaffolds, you know. Worked at a bank, I was a teller, you know work didn't, and so I've done a lot of wild and interesting jobs.

I just kind of just that leaned into my skill set and I think most people think that a lot of people will have this one career trajectory, just like go to college, study the finance, get a job in finance, skip promoted in finance, become a boss in finance. And I think it's so interesting because you're following Some, you're passionate, in this case, you're following your love as well, and sometimes look at me, I'm in Minneapolis the farthest thing from the both coasts because I live in New York, in LA, and it's because of love and you know, I've seen, you've met Natalie and I'm grateful to be here and it's a completely fish out of the war experience for me, so much so that I'm asked my partner, natalie's father, to. Maybe you want to teach me how to shoot a gun.

:: 11:27

Wow.

:: 11:28

So just kind of like you know, interesting, because you have an interesting relationship here, especially a big hunting community, and you have respect for what they do and you know we eat stuff that he's hunted, you know, and it's so interesting. I think there's something to be said for continuously being put out of our comfort zone Into different environments, different experiences, because it sort of all makes us what we are today.

:: 11:51

Well, you certainly had a lot more jobs. I mean, you and I come from the time when you didn't change jobs that often these days it's pretty much expected for one reason or another. But I mean, yeah, a lot of people come out with that idea of that corporate ladder getting out of college One career path that doesn't exist anymore. I mean, it's for some, for some, but then I think they're looking at like the career ladder of a startup which didn't exist back then.

It's very interesting and totally different. But now you can jump jobs and then there's so many new jobs it didn't exist five, ten years ago. Almost ten years ago we had this conversation. I had no idea I was gonna be a podcast editor as a career who does that yeah? So Now it can be a full-time job.

:: 12:35

Yeah, Believe it or not and I did shed a tear and we talked about this at the conference. When we connected, you had to steer to part ways with your collection. The big bear spot on the wall used to be a wall of records.

:: 12:48

Yeah yeah, I gave it up. I sold them to a guy that it was totally fitting for him, so it was a great option.

:: 12:55

What I don't want to have to move these talk a little bit about that process, because I'm sure that's not a decision you make overnight especially. I mean I'm thinking myself. I've carried my vinyl collection has been with me from New York to Atlanta, back to New York and then over to California and then Pull that a storage and so whatever's left and can fit in a those IKEA Bookcases that you do sideways eight panels. That's about what I got left.

:: 13:17

Right, yeah, I've got these metal racks over here that held thousands and most of them were 12 inch vinyl remixes. They're dance records. So it was a very unique collection because again grew up in Chicago, was DJing, so I bought not LPs but 12 inch vinyl. We're gonna bring people down here.

Bring them up so we've already talked yeah, already talked about how I was DJ in high school. I was in a break dancing group in high school and my best friend was leader of the crew. Yeah, and Obviously the whole crew was full of friends.

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Now, what's the name? The crew.

:: 13:50

It was the crew, masters.

:: 13:51

Okay, yeah.

:: 13:53

We're one of the only break dancing groups in the Chicago suburbs. There were some in Chicago proper, but still it was kind of like an outlier thing, but anyway. So my best friend, he passed away in September 2021. Okay, not for the things that we thought would happen.

medical problems. And then in: 2019

:: 15:08

Yeah.

:: 15:08

We lost him to COVID because, I mean, when you're going through chemo and you're dealing with cancer and all the medications, and here's this new drug that he can't take is nobody knows exactly what it's gonna do to him. Yeah, he eventually gets COVID, and they just yeah. So because we lost him and because I was no longer DJ, I didn't really feel the need to keep the vinyl around.

Yeah if I've got digital versions of stuff, I can play them and it's probably easier. I'm not gonna turn turntables on, I'm gonna open up my music app and play him from there. Yeah, I'm always gonna have it on my phone with me or whatever, so I can remember Tim anywhere I go with my phone. Why keep a ton worth of vinyl around? Yeah, so I came to that conclusion that you know what? It's okay for me to sell the vinyl. I actually sold my CDs as well.

Okay all, but maybe 100, 150 CDs. Big collection, yeah, and what am I gonna use them for? Yeah so, yeah, I just found some people who could use them and I was okay with letting it go.

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Yeah, where do they come from? They weren't in town right there from out of town, the folks who bought right, right.

:: 16:12

So I moved to st Louis in the year 98 and but all around, most of the records would really Most of them would be for someone who lives in Chicago.

:: 16:21

Okay, I would know the music.

:: 16:23

Yeah. So the guy came down with a big you haul. We loaded it up and he hauled it back.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

:: 16:30

I have to say goodbye to them. So Interesting to have that connection to something that was a big part of your life. I'm curious Did you have a specific move in the break dancing crew?

:: 16:41

Yeah, there's a lot of people who reference it to like the Russian dance where you're. How do you describe?

:: 16:46

it on audio.

:: 16:47

So you're got your hands on the floor and your feet on the floor, but you're kind of looking at the ceiling oh, okay, and you kick one leg up yeah, okay, standing on the other, and then you switch.

:: 16:55

Yeah, midair.

:: 16:56

Yeah, so it was kind of my thing, but I was the DJ so I didn't have to dance that much.

:: 17:00

And I think the moment that I saw Beach Street. It's probably the first time that I think. I don't know if there's something that I saw on camera in terms of break dancing and I just remember. I never forget that experience because it's like the battles, the music as a DJ, that whole scene Just growing up around that time, just it was so exciting. You need to see that. And then, obviously, growing up in New York City and you need to see it in live on the street. But I don't know if you've been following. I follow on some of these, the new wave of break dancers. Yeah, japan, it's huge in Japan and and rise some of these competitions.

The moves that they're doing, steve, are Banana is like defying gravity type of stuff. It is crazy and some of the old moves, I think, still hold up. But the stuff that kids are doing now Break dancing wise it blows my mind that you can even, like, do that with your body.

:: 17:45

It's pretty crazy, yeah well, once you say it's like the four-minute mile, the guy broke it and then everybody else started breaking it yeah, so once yeah, once you see somebody else doing, you're like oh, I can do that.

:: 17:54

Yeah.

:: 17:55

I can do that. It's possible, so I'm not gonna break my back trying it, or maybe do that. Yeah yeah, yeah, and I guess maybe next year break dancing and Olympics, oh, yeah, that would be interesting.

:: 18:06

I mean, it's almost like gymnastics to some extent in terms of how they score gymnastics and they see one do someone do a flip or something on the horse. They're gauging their ability to do something with precision. I guess is how you, if they can come up with a scoring system for gymnastics, didn't come up with this scoring system?

:: 18:23

Right originality Three, four judges with the cards that say one through ten. Yeah, hold them up in the air. Yeah, my best friend, he was very much a maven for pop, for break dancing, oh yeah, and for hip-hop in general. Yeah and he was in a couple documentaries and all this time he was what's his name? My best friend's name.

:: 18:41

Yeah, the one who, yeah, you talking about, yeah, tim at that was Tim.

:: 18:44

Okay, yeah, matters and he was always promoting hip-hop and he was a mural artist. So, paint murals in high schools.

:: 18:53

Wow.

:: 18:53

What a great place to influence people about hip-hop and we were always on the clean side of hip-hop. There's the bad side, or the perception of bad. You know the drugs. We were anti drugs. We were anti all the violence and stuff like that. We're using break dancing for what it truly should have been From the competition oh, coming together as a group. Yeah, a lot of good stuff in there, and so, man, he meets some people, these high schools, and they had some really wicked moves too.

:: 19:16

Yeah, just oh yeah, I break dance to, and then they do something while he's painting. Crazy they never get captured on film, oh yeah.

:: 19:25

Yes, Tim always took pictures and video and stuff.

:: 19:27

Is there any of you break dancing on film, or yeah?

:: 19:30

We have a DVD. In fact, we just celebrated our 40th anniversary of the crew masters, so me and a couple of the main guys got together. We not just had the celebration but a memorial for a friend and we watched the DVD he put together.

:: 19:42

20 years ago. It's the 20th anniversary.

:: 19:45

Yeah, there's some video, not much a couple of the big ones I had to miss out on, or I was the DJ in the back.

:: 19:50

I wasn't breaking. Well, if you get onto YouTube, send us the link. We can put in the short notes too.

:: 19:55

We would be breaking copy, like all the music you know. Yeah, that's a perfect be. Oh yeah, nucleus jam on Africa bambada, yeah, all that stuff.

:: 20:05

So I'm curious, like you know, what happened to your friend Tim, and is this something that you think about as you get older? In terms of life, is this the cliche life is short, but also just enjoying living life to the fullest and you think about that stuff a lot more?

:: 20:20

Yes. Yeah what's interesting is so Tim, my best friend, passed from COVID. It was after he passed. I'm always reflecting on things that we did and like he did some things he shouldn't have been doing because there was financial issues when you got all these medical bills you have financial issues and he did things that they weren't smart.

But then he was living life and Tim loved living life and because he loved living life, he also became more attractive to other people, meaning he was just somebody that you liked. Yeah, he didn't stop to think what was more responsible. He did things because of relationships. Okay so I Think about that now too is like Lighten up, steve, it doesn't all have to be about budgets and, yeah, what's gonna be best in five years? So, yeah, I thought about that a lot since he passed.

:: 21:08

Is there anything, any decisions you've made recently that five years ago Steve or ten years ago Steve probably wouldn't have done because he?

:: 21:15

well Sold the records in the CDs. I mean that was definitely something that was influenced because of there's no need for the records anymore. Yeah, if Tim was still around, I would still have the records, because he would come over and we'd Just spin records whenever he came to visit from Chicago. That's not so and I'm okay with it. Again, I've perfectly fine with Letting all that go and having digital versions. So that was probably the big thing.

:: 21:38

Yeah, yeah. And what's the story behind the run DMC shirt?

:: 21:41

Oh, Gosh, we're big fans we had front-row tickets in a Madison Wisconsin concert.

:: 21:47

Oh, really Okay yeah.

:: 21:48

So I've got three of these not this one, but there's like four, I think, four types of these classic shirts and I had three of them.

:: 21:55

What year did you go to the run DMC concert?

:: 21:58

Gosh, I have that CD 1985.

:: 22:04

oh, that's pinnacle, yeah, that's before king of rock.

:: 22:07

So it was after a couple of the big hits walk this way. It wasn't the first concert we saw on that either, so it's just the one week I used to work at a record store.

:: 22:16

So they had a ticket master outlet there.

:: 22:19

Wow, and we're talking old-school stuff here and so I was able to, you know, score us some tickets, because nobody in the suburbs of Chicago where I was selling right tickets at we're in line to buy around the DMC tickets in Madison, wisconsin. Yeah, so I was able to get in there and legally Honor, honestly, or what do you call it you know I wasn't cheating to get first row.

:: 22:40

Yeah, front row. What was that show like? I never got to see any of. Like I'm trying to think of a got to see any of the old-school hip-hop artists Live. I mean, they were just around, but I don't think that I've ever saw them in concert.

:: 22:53

Yeah, oh man, they were good, but I'll tell you what probably I remember. There's two concerts I remember most. One we saw LL Cool J and Bobby Brown After his first album, just before his second album dropped. Saw him open up for LL Cool J.

:: 23:11

Yeah, I.

:: 23:12

Didn't know anything about Bob. Oh really, he's a performer man. Yeah, it's like this is good, but we can't see cool J and he was, of course, killing it yeah and it was at the rose, not the Rosemont. Anyways, a smaller theater, so maybe not even a thousand people.

Yeah, but the other one was at the Rosemont theater, which in Chicago is a big. This is the big theater you go to see concerts in indoor concerts and we had probably 40th row or something like that and we found ourselves up to the 20th row not honestly there, but that was like one of those. They had like eight different artists.

:: 23:45

Oh yeah, you had Bismarck he. Oh.

:: 23:48

I didn't care for as much back then, but the one that blew me away. I'd heard the name. We listened to some records, but they did such a great job. It just totally transformed me to be an Eric B in her camera.

:: 23:58

Oh my god, of course, yeah, oh, when you got that bass hitting you and everybody in the room is just yeah, oh man, they could have a master plan.

:: 24:09

Yeah, wow, just Classic. So some of those concerts just completely changed your mind on the artist, and that one definitely did it.

:: 24:17

Especially rappers, that back then I think people under appreciate the skill of rapping or what it takes. And I think a big daddy Kane, I think of Eric B and rock him like true lyricist. When you listen, if you, you enjoy it. You probably get to into the music or their songs because of the groove, because of the beat, but then if you like, slow down and are you. Now it's so easy to get lyrics or songs nowadays and you can follow along and just amazing, like some of the Songs that they would write and just, or the lyrics they would write and just like. If you think about that now that's the true skill itself, like that ability to do that.

:: 24:49

Do you remember the DLC, the portrait of a masterpiece? No, oh my gosh, okay, so that guy is just yeah, hitting it, hitting it and you listen to. It takes you gotta listen to three times, just catch up with the lyrics. Yeah, and the beat is fan, you'll listen to it, you go. Oh, I know that song. I'm sure you spun it once or twice.

:: 25:08

Yeah, okay.

:: 25:09

But, man, I don't know why, that one just came to mind, but that was just this one song that anytime I hear it, blood pressure goes up, feel like spinning on the floor.

:: 25:18

It's fantastic yeah there's certain music that's made for break dancing and there's certain beats, and so that breakbeat, that amen breakbeat, and just like there's certain things that you hear and just like, oh, you just feel like even me that never got. I mean, I never was able to like pull off a windmill, or you know, I just got some like footwork. And that's about the extent of it, because when you see, even just it would have been nice To just pull off maybe the worm. I think that's probably something. Yeah, and definitely some poppin and lockin, but definitely when you that stuff is next level, but it's really just driven. How much of it is driven by the energy of the music and how I feel it outhouse music like a song will pull me on to the dance floor Like I'll hear it and I'll be like I got to go dance, like I have to go move to this beat.

:: 26:00

It's like really interesting that was Arthur Baker, breakers, revenge and just those types of records. They were just fantastic samples of things, but really, yeah, recreated into this completely new energetic beat that you had to get on the floor.

:: 26:14

Yeah, it was a good. I mean, I'm sure every one of their generation says this is the best time for music or something like that. But I think honestly, when you get to see births of Music, like the birth of hip-hop from the birth of house music, again from Chicago, just like, it feels like a very special time because there's something Interesting about the energy of a movement as it's happening and people like what's this sound or what's it's so exciting. Have you seen the Elvis movie?

:: 26:40

I have not.

:: 26:41

It's interesting because I had. I always wondered how come no one's ever made a movie about Elvis. He's just iconic artist and that copyright deserves like a Ray Charles type-esque movie. And finally they made it and there's this one scene in there where they show him the first time he starts singing and moving and jarring his hips Right. This is the 50s or whatever it was and it was. They showed the moment where women were like just kind of like losing their mind, they're like shaking. And then all of a sudden, the first one was like Like it comes out of her mouth in a way, like she can't control it because she's just like what's happening here, like I'm seeing something I've never seen before, you know, and the boyfriends are next to me, like all like weird and nervous, but I felt the energy of watching that, you know, kind of the same way, like when I first like the first rap I heard I think was Roxanne Chante and oh yeah, and which is a answer record novelty song.

UTFO. But there was that whole battle thing going on, like Kara's rappers about battle each other with music. It's funny, interesting breakers battling, but with dance. And the first time I heard Roxanne Chante I was like I can't understand what she's saying. Like this he's literally rapping so fast that I was like it's so new to me, like this experience and over time obviously you get to hear it and you get to follow along, but Just overall, just that energy of experiencing something new for the first time is pretty wild.

:: 27:57

I Literally had 12 different songs from people in that whole, roxanne. It's like the expansion pack or something like that. I mean, it was crazy, how many different people did a song about Roxanne, roxanne, wow.

:: 28:13

She ended up having it. She actually had a little biopic made about her on Netflix. I don't know if you've seen it, but it's about Roxanne Chante and growing up in Queens, so that's pretty exciting.

:: 28:23

Yeah, you have to wonder where they. I mean, we're doing a kind of where we are today type of thing, but where are they? Yes, where are they.

:: 28:29

Yeah that those are. It's behind. It's probably we need a behind-the-music VH1 for, like all these rappers and and you know what?

:: 28:37

it's interesting because you can find a lot of this stuff. I mean, wikipedia is such a great resource for all kinds of things, but there is one artist that I can't find anything on Freestar artists okay that, but she goes by the name of Monet okay and she had some. These are like Miami beat high energy type records. I just my heart gets all the breaks. Oh yeah Me. Wow gosh, Is it Carlos Barbosa?

:: 29:03

I think yeah, yeah, yeah, wow, I know all that stuff.

:: 29:07

This stuff was just but.

:: 29:08

I can't find anything about her. What happened to her?

:: 29:11

So how do you find out? I guess you got to go back and find people who knew the people.

:: 29:15

Yeah, there's probably Facebook groups talking about freestyle. I mean because that was the precursor to house music and it was like a mix of the yes Miami based sound and disco sound, and I mean freestyle music is its own subgenre, but I had a ton of freestyle and vinyl as well too.

:: 29:33

Yeah, anything from mick mac records. Yeah those are great. Yeah. Fever records cover girls yeah.

:: 29:41

I'm going through the vinyl in my mind right now. It's like flicking through the vinyl, yeah profile records with the red and black.

:: 29:47

Yeah sweet sensation I.

:: 29:49

Was.

:: 29:49

Wow, we are really just reflecting on old. We've just completely alienated most of your listeners.

:: 29:54

Well, I think it's also showing like the diversity of like everything that's made me and made you who we am. I have a DJ soundcloud and it's mostly house mixes, it's DJ HD on soundcloud and so I'm about 12, 13 mixes over the years that I put together. But I was like I was pulling records, just mp3's, the other day and I was like I think I'm gonna make a freestyle mix. So I've got about 20 or 30 songs I'm gonna go through and I'm just gonna make a freestyle mix and just put that on soundcloud and just for fun, just because we can again like it's just a nice trip down memory lane and might be in.

:: 30:26

You don't get trouble Copywriting stuff like that.

:: 30:29

No, it's not quite, it's all mix, it's all DJ mixes, anyway. So Occasionally they'll mention something about a song. But I mean, soundcloud started as DJ mixes and, funny enough, I've mentioned this a couple times when I first heard the word podcast this is 2012. I Understood it to be a DJ mix, like I didn't know where people spoke on pot, like I didn't know about podcast with people speaking. So DJ was like I got a new podcast up and I think, oh, cool, that means a DJ mix. And go to SoundCloud and I go listen to his podcast and there's only like when I created a mobile app for electronic music Called know your DJ that, and then I said, and I started finding these podcast people talking about mobile apps, I was like, oh, there's actually like, it's actually like it's my people.

There's my people. Yeah, so it's, but I have to thank Probably DJing for getting me into podcasting. I.

:: 31:17

It's funny a lot of people get into it are from radio or television or they got some kind of my entertainment background.

:: 31:24

So yeah, that makes sense. So bring now, bring that, but see, because we can bring everything full circle back, because now we're going to talk about podcast editing.

:: 31:33

Oh yeah, my favorite subject.

:: 31:36

Okay, so if anyone's following the threads, we can just pull all those things together and see how, because of everything you've been doing in the podcast space obviously you know you're doing people wanted your help and specifically, it's interesting that this thinks about podcast editing. Is that different than what you would consider? Just a full service podcast agency?

:: 31:54

Oh yeah absolutely, because it's really specific to the post production side. Okay this Facebook group that I have. All we do is talk about post production or running a podcast setting business. We don't talk about mics and mixers and talk about who's the best media host. We don't talk about how to grow an audience, get on other shows. That's all been done in the other groups. So, it's really podcast editing and people can argue with me on this, but they're wrong. It is post production. We can't edit yourself as you're recording.

Okay, you can stop from saying things like I have. It's funny. I listened back to episode 22 of podcast junkies and I still the same verbal crutch.

:: 32:29

This is my crutch.

:: 32:31

So I can maybe stop myself from saying you know, but that's not really editing.

:: 32:34

Yeah.

:: 32:35

Post production.

:: 32:36

So when did it start to take? Because becoming a podcast editor and doing it for clients is one thing, but there's also a certain amount of responsibility and extra work required when you decide you want to have a community around it as well. So what was the decision to do that and why'd you feel you wanted to take that on?

:: 32:54

I was being selfish, so I started this in 2016, started editing full time, 2016. And then 2017, it was right around my birthday in January of 2017. I'm like you know what there's always great Facebook groups for podcasters. There's nothing talking about the post production side. I want to have a discussion about post production. I thought, well, if nobody else is going to create one, I guess I'll do it. And I knew a couple of people who were editing. I didn't know if they were doing it for money or just they did it themselves, but I invited a few, get it going and within just a month, I think, I had at least a hundred people in there and, over the years, people just because that community is. Yes, we're in competition with each other, but really there's enough room to go around enough business. So we've just been collaborative and helpful and we can also lean on each other's shoulders when we're crying about how this was such a horrible editing job. But it's grown to over 8,700 members Wow, yeah, since 2017.

:: 33:50

Is it still a Facebook?

:: 33:51

It's just because I wanted the group and I still love it.

:: 33:53

Is it still a Facebook group? Yeah, how has the dynamic of the group changed when it's a couple of hundred now to now 8,700?

:: 34:01

Really, the biggest change has been in the past year or two. The majority of people joining now, well, that majority, I would say almost half the people coming in. Well, these would be new people too, though, so I don't know if they're actually new editors, but they're now saying that their main editing program because they have. I have three, four questions they have to answer when they join the group. That way I know that they're qualified to be in the group. And the first one is what do you edit with? If they say Microsoft Word, they don't get into my group.

If they say anchor, they're not getting into my group, I have one person say PowerPoint.

:: 34:31

What, yeah, editing audio with PowerPoint?

:: 34:34

It's obviously they weren't the right people for the group but the majority of people coming in now their editing program is Premiere Pro, davinci, resolve, logic Pro and Descript which are all video editors.

:: 34:49

Descript does a lot of things.

:: 34:52

So it's really just this huge focus on editing video which, in 2024, I do believe YouTube will legitimately have a podcast app for YouTube podcasts. I know that we have the channels now, but I don't consider that a podcast yet.

:: 35:08

And what about Hindenburg?

:: 35:10

Well, Hindenburg doesn't edit video.

:: 35:12

So you're saying how many people? Yeah, in terms of people, yeah.

:: 35:16

Okay. Well, this is interesting because you caught me in a good time. I'm going to pull something up on my computer and I'll tell you what it's in there. But we just revealed the results from our 2023 podcast editor industry survey, and so we asked people things. The professional podcast editors in the community say hey, if you don't mind, we'll anonymize the information, but tell us what are you charging, how long does it take you to work on it? And then, so we can extrapolate information. Let's see average rate going on out there how long does it take people to do?

And what's the most popular DAWs? Now, we're talking specifically audio here, not NLEs, which are video, but it's NLE, stand for it. Non-linear editor.

:: 35:52

Okay.

:: 35:53

I had to learn that myself this year.

:: 35:56

How sad is that.

:: 35:58

So we're all growing. The main DAW is still by far. It's at least two X, even the number no. The next one in the line is audition Adobe audition Okay. Yep, it's always number one.

:: 36:10

Yeah, by a lot of time. Yeah.

:: 36:13

In the past. The second one has been very close, neck and neck, audacity, yeah, and Reaper.

:: 36:19

Yeah, okay.

:: 36:22

And then fourth place was Hindenburg. That's traditionally what it's been Now. Second place is Reaper. Pro tools is third, which I find interesting because a lot of places when people came into the podcast editing industry came from that used pro tools came from radio.

Yeah or television, you know, studio, and now it's number three, and then audacity number four and the Hindenburgs number five. Okay, and we've got some theories as to why that is because now Descript is in the top seven, yeah, and it wasn't ever in the top seven before. Because man, descript is just doing some wow interesting crazy things and with more focus on video. Descriptors, video, so yeah it just makes sense. People are doing the script for their audio and video needs.

:: 37:06

When was the inflection point in the community and the interest or growth and editors doing Focused on video or beginning to add video?

:: 37:16

It's been the past year or two, yeah, I mean there has been, I'd say, ever since Audiograms became a thing that people thought would work, and I don't think they really do.

the Focus for video being posted in social grew quite a bit and then, with the ease of putting YouTube videos up, everybody started putting their podcast there, whether it was an actual recording or the still frame Image of their show logo with the audio playing. Then YouTube became, you know, video platform for podcasts. But in the past year or two is definitely when there was more focus on generating more social clips With the moving, the actual people talking, the words popping up on screen. Actually has been two or three years for that. Yeah and along. Well, if I'm already learning how to use some kind of video editing tool to do this, why not just Start editing the videos as well?

:: 38:07

How different is what they learn or what they get from the community around understanding how to edit a video podcast versus Just editing a standard video? Are there nuances between you know someone who's just a video editor knows how to edit video, versus someone who's specifically editing a video that's a podcast?

:: 38:28

Wait, the difference between adding a video and editing a video podcast.

:: 38:31

Yeah Well, in the past you'd have video editors that just that was their trade and obviously you know it's been more. There's so much competition for that space that it's you would pay premium if you, if someone told you there was a video editor, you're like, okay, this is gonna cost me an arm and a leg for three or four, five hundred dollars for a video, for one episode or something Like that. And now you know that's not the case anymore. I mean, I had a video to with the script and it's so easy. But do they have to have a like a mind's, like a difference? I'm just wondering if people who have been editing traditionally podcast audio Do they have a leg up because they understand podcasting when they move into video?

:: 39:05

I Don't think so. I don't think that's. I mean yes in a way, but not to the extent I think most people would. We can say just because you're in podcast land doesn't mean. I'm editing audio doesn't mean you can edit a video podcast At a higher level than somebody who knows how to edit video. Yeah and we can go back to what people think might be editing. A podcast, audio podcast is oh well. I take the recording, I put it into a die, put the intro and outro on it and I'm done. That's editing.

:: 39:33

Yeah.

:: 39:34

Not really. It can be considered editing, but a very small. That's really not. I don't consider editing. Same with video. Then people take their zoom recordings and throw them up on YouTube and they might cut off the beginning and end when they're doing some chit chat or whatever and that's editing Because they brought it into a video editing program, but not really. Yeah, but if you're gonna be doing something and I pray people who do video podcast, true video podcast Do this. We've got the cameras, we're switching cameras, we're putting slides on there lower thirds, yeah, title sites, whatever we're making it a little more dynamic, a little more entertaining, a little more than just two talking heads. Yeah, because if we're gonna use YouTube and say these are podcasts, I pray that they're good and not just oh, this is just two people talking. I don't like this. Podcasting sucks.

No don't be smirch podcasting, because somebody threw the zoom recording up on on YouTube. Yeah so the video editing piece of it. I mean I would hope that people do more editing of the actual recordings and that could involve, like I said, camera switching is a big thing.

Right there it's easier to hide and by cutting it out and switching the camera angle when it happened, and that's probably the one major benefit to having Multiple cameras for either one person or for if you got two people, yeah because I could switch to like, if I get Boring or I'm not doing anything exciting on screen, we could easily switch right to Harry's picture where he's going yeah, and then come right back and you took out my arm, or something like that.

:: 41:07

Yeah or yeah. I mean, if I was had enough time to dig through some of these, I'd probably put some a snippet of Beat Street, yeah, or interlude. We're playing the Monet song while we're having this conversation.

:: 41:22

Last chance by Siri. Yes, that's a jam. Yeah, I feel like we're gonna need to In-depth show notes for this chapter markers yeah, but going back to the video piece with the editing, now we're talking strictly about more about the editing and not the engineering. And the audio, the post-production engineering. We're talking about audio. We're talking about light Focus stuff like that. So there's more to it than just editing.

Yeah but I think in this discussion, as we're talking about editing people Please forgive me by not talking about those other things we're just gonna include them in the word editing for video and audio here.

:: 42:01

But it would seem that anyone who's got a strong fundamentals in editing Tools like the script makes their job easier. But the fact that they the grounding helps them to be probably a better editor in something like the script.

:: 42:14

Is that? I don't know. Descript it's completely different animal.

:: 42:17

Yeah.

:: 42:17

I mean anybody can. If I were to start from nothing, I would probably have to start with the script.

:: 42:22

Yeah, I agree.

:: 42:23

Although Hindenburg has been a very attractive DAW, but it doesn't do video. So, yeah, the script is a completely different animal. You're editing text like a word document. How does that edit audio and video? And then you put these slashes in there and it changes the scenes. You can switch cameras, you can bring in b-roll.

:: 42:40

Yeah.

:: 42:41

You could export snippets and they could then have the words on the screen. So now you have your sound bites for social media. Holy crap, it's all in one amazing.

:: 42:51

I haven't done what they've done I haven't played around too much with the snippets and the playing around with the scenes, and so you can create a snippet in the text section. Are you putting brackets around the one, that thing that you want? Yes, your snippet is that you're saying or you highlight it yeah, okay.

:: 43:06

Or you can I mean yeah, it's what did you give a word document? You could take the paragraph, highlight it with your cursor. Yeah you're working with that piece. You can move it anywhere you want, yeah, and it moves it in the final product, or you can export it out as the snippet, or it's just my, and now they have live recording stuff like squadcast, which Harry Durand is using right now. Use promo code. What is it?

:: 43:31

podcastcom. I don't even know if it works anymore, because now it's. That's the script, so Congrats to the team for that acquisition. But I just saw today that they announced they're adding the AI tools. They will find the snippet for you now.

:: 43:46

Yeah, yeah so there's some other programs out there. They're very interesting doing the same thing. But if it's built in with this within the script it's kind of like yeah, it's Walmart.

:: 43:54

Yeah, one stop shopping. Where do you see this headed in terms of it's just more? Is it helping the indie podcaster have the confidence to handle more of these things in-house, because that would be the big bear in the past? It's like I'm just gonna do the bare minimum. I'm not gonna edit because I can't afford an editor.

:: 44:11

Yes and no. Here we're talking about podcasting. Of course the answer is it. It depends.

Yeah it depends. As the LZ answer, yeah, I think that the people who truly want to do a show and will not pay or cannot pay Somebody else to help them with it, Then they might use a tool. I don't know if it's gonna be the script because it costs money Depends on how cheap they are now. If they really get into the craft of post-production, yeah, they're gonna be interested in tools like Hindenburg, like descript, like DaVinci resolve. They might just go that direction.

That's what I did end up using Isotope RX because I heard about it and it's now something I use all the time to clean up mouth clicks and take out the lower end of the bass and voice. You know, I mean, it's a tool I never heard of and once I learned what it was, I was like, okay, because I was interested in it actually made me a Better editor. Thank goodness, both video, you've got a lot to try it and commit yourself to learning it. There's lots of software programs I've wanted to learn and I haven't, just because I haven't committed the time to it. That's my problem. But if I were to open up and I would go with spending a whole week learning to script, I'm sure it would completely change what I do.

:: 45:24

Yeah, I think it's a function of putting in the time and I run an agency so we have folks that do it on the team. So sometimes I'll go in because I want to learn it. But at some point I feel like, do I want to grow the inchy or do I want to like learn how to use this script? And the hobbyist and Me is this like oh, it's such a interesting tool to and fun, it's actually fun to work with, you know when you know what you're doing in there. And so I think when I first started editing audio I stayed away from a long time but I did take a mastering class.

I was using Ableton live. I don't know if anyone's using Ableton live in your group, but it was what I knew. I learned how to produce because I was producing electronic music. And then I learned the mastering suite, pro Tools, and then all the isotope, sweet Ozone, all that stuff there to really make stuff sound pristine. So it's really fun. But I think I'll give the RX suite another look. It's been a while since I've taken a look at that.

:: 46:09

RX 10 advanced. Has dialogue, isolate dialogue, dialogue D reverb. So it's not just D reverb, it's dialogue, d it's just oh, wow. Yeah, but what it can't do is recreate the voice which guess what the script.

:: 46:25

This is the script hour.

rience that I had Starting in: 2014

:: 47:13

Well, my whole life has changed because of it. Yeah, I was a consumer and I wanted to get into it. I did. That lasted five years and then it became a career, editing for other people who I like, and because it's the kind type of content I was creating, because it was really what my interest was in. So I get to work with my peers, my friends. Yeah, life is. I am blessed. I am blessed to be able to work on my own schedule.

My wife quit her toxic job in: 2021

:: 47:59

Can you talk a little bit about the community, because I think obviously that's how we met and you know we got to chat for a little bit with and I got to chat with your lovely wife at the conference as well, recently in Park yes movement. Oh right, yeah, and so how's that been? Because I mean, I there's friends that I I only have because of podcasting as well, so it's interesting right.

:: 48:18

Well, I'm sure you felt it, but the podcast movement podcast. I go to all these conferences, the podcast centric ones that I attend and. There's some people that you know, and you're at this point right now I'm searching for people I know we're in a sea of people that I've never had the opportunity to meet and it's good and bad. More people are coming in, but that means I'm looking for somebody I know to talk to again, but I'm not meeting the new people. What's?

sation we had in September of: 2014

:: 49:14

Looking at who attends and the community, no, just kind of thinking back, like looking back, and sometimes they always say like sometimes you move so fast that it's hard to just pause and say, like, look back and like, oh, wow, look how far I've gotten, or look what I've accomplished, or look where I'm at, or I have a business because of this, and I'm guilty of it too Like I'm just go, go, go or just what's the next thing or what's the next client, or you know, and you don't really think Sometimes you just got to savor the wins and I think it's a nice opportunity to do that and for me personally to be grateful for everything that is introduced and it's exciting to see I remember, and you and I both remember just mentioning the word podcast to people in 2014. And just be like, what's that? I don't know what that is and it's rare. You see that Edison research chart. Like it's pretty rare for anyone not to know what a podcast is now. So it's, it's fun to watch.

:: 50:05

Or get a misinterpretation of what one is if it's just on YouTube.

:: 50:08

Yeah, so you think YouTube's going to have its own player? Not like YouTube.

:: 50:13

Oh, it will. Yeah, youtube podcast YouTube music is the podcast app. I guess it is now.

It's just that they haven't ingested the RSS feed yet, so it doesn't automate it. But YouTube, if your show was only here, I'm going to get myself into trouble. Youtube proper versus YouTube music. Youtube proper was not a podcast app for two main reasons, and actually Tom Webster defined it brilliantly you couldn't listen to YouTube or watch YouTube if you didn't have connection to the internet, because you couldn't download the files to your device and unless you're paying for YouTube, whatever the YouTube plan is, once you turn off your screen, audio stops.

:: 50:59

That's not a podcast app.

:: 51:01

YouTube music is going to allow that, and I think it does now, so thank goodness. And then, once they ingest RSS feeds, it's all over Anything that goes on to that and for what I understand, I could be wrong, but for what I understand is if you whether it's video or audio if you give them your RSS feed, then it's going to pull the audio to YouTube music and then you have an actual podcast app for Google.

:: 51:22

Are they going to tie the you because you can designate a playlist in YouTube as a podcast, which we do now for our clients and is it going to be able to tie my Captivate RSS feed if I ingest that to the fact that there's a YouTube also indication there's a podcast playlist in there and tie them together and sync them up?

:: 51:43

Right, we'll simplify this. You have to create a playlist and label it podcast in YouTube or YouTube I don't know how you do it for YouTube music yet, but somewhere that's going to come to play, where you have a channel called Podcast, and then whatever you put there becomes podcast. If it's video, it can be on YouTube. If it's audio or if it's an RSS feed, it's going to be audio on YouTube music. That's where I understand.

:: 52:08

But when they say ingest an RSS feed right now, my RSS feed lives on Captivate, right, right.

:: 52:12

You'll submit it to YouTube and then it'll pull from it automatically.

:: 52:16

OK, but it won't be the video. It won't be the video, it'll be audio.

:: 52:20

That's what I understand it to be.

:: 52:22

It'll be interesting to watch, for sure, and I mean we always would try to get stuff on YouTube anyway, because it's the number two search engine, all that. So it feels like it'll be a game changer in terms of visibility. And I noticed this a couple years ago when I took a lift to the airport and I told him at a podcast and when we got he dropped me off. He's like oh, what's your podcast? And he pulls out his phone and he's got YouTube on. He's open. He's like what's your podcast? I was like, ah, that was a bit of a wake up call for me. I was like, ok, I've got to think about this differently and it's going to be. I think this idea of tying it to an artist's feed is as much as people like the purists want to hold on to that. I think it's just like a show, like when we've talked about this years ago. It's a show and it's going to be found where it's found.

:: 53:04

Right, but the problem is, if people are looking on their app and it's YouTube and it's not a video, it's not going to be Well unless you upload it as an audio only, with the square image type thing, to YouTube.

but it's not going to be a true podcast app, Not YouTube proper. It's got YouTube music. So that's what I hate most about YouTube killing off the Google Podcast app and moving to YouTube music is it's still going to be confusing to people who have podcasts. I know it's our fault too. Podcasts are just. This is our fault. We put our content on YouTube for exposure.

:: 53:39

Nothing wrong with that.

:: 53:41

But people started to expect that a podcast was on YouTube, even though YouTube proper is not a podcast app, not by the definition that I and Todd Webster have given it, where it's got to be. Off the internet, you can still listen or the screen can be off and you still listen without having to pay for the app. So you maybe get on the rabbit hole. Ok so, but a video podcast isn't just on YouTube either.

:: 54:05

That's true too.

:: 54:06

Look at Spotify, and Spotify has the closed wall garden thing for videos there, but they do offer you the RSS feed to put elsewhere, which is also going to be audio only.

:: 54:17

Yeah, that's interesting. I haven't tried that too, because we've got one client that's wanted to move their show to Spotify because they wanted it to be on video on Spotify, so that was the best way to do that, and I didn't know if we should ingest their RSS audio only feed as well, and I don't know if that's a separate channel. I've gotten on that rabbit hole. It gets completely confusing.

:: 54:35

If you want your video on YouTube, you upload it to YouTube. If you want your video on Spotify, if you go to Spotify for podcasters and use that, if you want them to be on each other, it's two separate uploads. And if you want it to be in a third place. It sounds like it's going to be another upload.

:: 54:49

The greater minds in us will figure this out, I'm sure, and tell us how it works.

:: 54:54

Please tell me how it works, thanks for having me on. Harry, this has been fun.

:: 54:57

I got a couple of last questions that we always ask. Number one what's something you changed your mind about recently?

:: 55:04

Wow, well, I'm not going to use the same answer I've been using the whole time, which is selling my CDs and my records. It's changed my mind on them recently that only eating meat, cheese and salt is bad for you. Ok, Believe it or not. I think it might be good for you because my wife and I have gotten on to the carnivore diet and it's been doing wonders for us.

:: 55:24

Wow.

:: 55:25

And she just got a blood test. So when we get the results I'll tell you later if it's actually true or not. That's interesting.

:: 55:31

Yeah, I've been more conscious of the type of meat and where we're sourcing it from as well, so I think that's been a big upgrade for us in terms of quality of food.

:: 55:41

Yeah, and we eat this stuff and I feel like this is wrong. But then we've been losing weight and we've been feeling better and it's like wait a minute. This is how people were eating before McDonald's, so why now?

:: 55:51

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Lastly, what is the most misunderstood thing about you?

:: 55:56

Most misunderstood thing about me. Then I got it all together. I'm a work in progress, just like everybody else. Yeah, I'm probably. My biggest problem is I'm judgmental and every day I reign it in. I reign it in because it's not my place to tell the people that I think they're wrong, because they're probably not wrong, it's just I didn't want to do it that way or something.

And so I have to humble myself and tell myself you're probably not right anyway, steve. So shut up, don't say anything. And I do, I'm successfully keeping it in because I'm. And then I realized later yeah, I didn't need to do anything. I was probably not, I was jumping to a conclusion.

:: 56:38

I think as we get into this or we have experienced this crazy world with everything that's happening out there, I think the more we can learn to just be open-minded and accepting of other people's opinions, even if they're wildly different from ours. I think that's one of this idea of just being more just, more accepting overall, because we're never going to agree on everything and then the more we find out, we find out more things we disagree about, and so I think the new skill is OK. I already know I'm going to disagree with about four or five things that are going to come out of your mouth, and I have to be OK with that and not impose my opinions on you. So I think that's a valuable lesson to learn.

:: 57:16

Yeah, and another reason why I got to just shut my mouth, because if I do say something, I'm going to alienate people and make friends.

:: 57:23

I'm going to get to meet people and then we don't have these wonderful debates and learn from each.

:: 57:27

I love the debates and learning from each other piece because I always learn something new and that's why my default is judgmental and I got to rein it in every single day.

:: 57:36

Yeah Well, that's a beautiful way to wrap this up, and I think the beauty of these conversations and I see and feel it when I listen to like a three hour conversation on Joe Rogan, I'm like, oh, I kind of get know this person now that you get to hear them, and then this is why this is an hour, but it's still.

I feel there's something about who you are as a person that gets transmitted through the fact that we're just BS and just shooting the shit and just talking about random topics and there and. But it's a conversation and it's the same thing we would, same one we'd be having if we were just sitting at the bar at the podcast movement, if we just had more time. And so I love this opportunity to slow down because, as much as I'd love to have these at podcast movement, we both know it's nearly impossible with all the stuff that's happening around us, and so I think I just will always treasure having this platform and even if five people or five thousand people listen, it's mostly for me because I get to connect with my podcast peeps and I don't see that ending anytime soon. So I appreciate you coming back for round two and sharing your story as air sharing our connections and our love and our passion for music, and I think that came through as well today.

:: 58:38

Music and podcasts.

:: 58:39

Yes, yes, so anywhere you want to send folks to connect with you.

:: 58:44

Yeah, they cannot. Well, if they're interested in getting into editing as a profession, come check out the podcast editor Academy. That's where we help people start and grow their podcast setting businesses. If you just want to hang out with other editors, talk about the post production side of podcasting, just go to podcast editors club and Facebook. That's the main platform that we have this community for all podcast editors, whether just doing it for themselves or they're doing it as a business.

:: 59:07

All right, perfect. We'll make sure all those links are in the show. Thanks again, my friend. This was a blast.

:: 59:11

Thanks, harry, so great to see you again.